55 replies to this topic

[Droid2drummer]

I wouldn't expect one for vzw devices. Might be able to trick it though...

Yeah I've seen the recent work...basically runs around via bypass...it works too but how stable is different... but progress is what we are all about regardless or speed we will always have someone pushing the bar...lol lovely.
Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[arcanexvi]

I asked a guy at Verizon tonight why they locked them down. He's a manager and said exactly what I thought. They lock them because of false warranty claims. They say that unlocking them means people would hack, some that don't know how to recovery would claim warranty replacements when issues happened.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

I posted a long article about this roughly 6 months ago.

[droidian1441]

Yes you did.

Im sorry to say this but VZW will NEVER let this happen. Maby moto gsm phones but not us, jmo. They locked down the sgs3, first sammy device to be locked up. That should tell you right there, what the future is. Teathering and other things is nothing to them we are still paying high monthly payments and buying phones. So why would they change anything? To them they are going to make it so secure, that if, the sec you root your phone or alter anything, system wise, you will be red flagged. I think this is the case with the new sgs. Im afraid its only going to get worse. If it gets better, i will be surprised. I say hope for the best and expect the worst!

GSM might get it first, if at all, IMO. The SGS3 was completely screwed over by Verizon. I saw a picture over on Droid-Life that somebody sent back his SGS3 because of the bootloader being locked. He plainly wrote on the package "Bootloader locked -- No thanks!" and sent it back. Lmao.

VZW is going to make things go way downhill from here. Just like you, if it gets better, I too will be a bit surprised.

Meanwhile it is not like we aren't having fun doing with what we have accomplished now!

[G8orDroid]

I asked a guy at Verizon tonight why they locked them down. He's a manager and said exactly what I thought. They lock them because of false warranty claims. They say that unlocking them means people would hack, some that don't know how to recovery would claim warranty replacements when issues happened.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

I realize this was just a store manager and not someone who makes the policy, but that reasoning is IMO, ridiculous. The fact is, if there were an unlock method for the bootloader, they would probably have fewer warranty claims, since MOST people who would actually unlock it, would be able to recover it. Either with their own personal knowledge or help from the community.

Also, why not have the ability to restore a phone available at the VzW store? Since they're all about making money, charge $50 bucks a pop to restore the phone. A couple hours training and some online documentation and any 18 yr. old nerd could do it with minimal infrastructure costs. If the bootloader were unlocked, this would be a practical way of doing things.

Lastly, why not provide an unlock method that would caution the user that unlocking the phone would void the warranty and if they proceeded the IMEI of the phone would be logged and no warranty repairs would be allowed. Oh wait, I think someone already did that.

I know this has been beaten to death in thread after thread, but I just had to vent a little. Sorry.

[VincentL2189]

I realize this was just a store manager and not someone who makes the policy, but that reasoning is IMO, ridiculous. The fact is, if there were an unlock method for the bootloader, they would probably have fewer warranty claims, since MOST people who would actually unlock it, would be able to recover it. Either with their own personal knowledge or help from the community.

Also, why not have the ability to restore a phone available at the VzW store? Since they're all about making money, charge $50 bucks a pop to restore the phone. A couple hours training and some online documentation and any 18 yr. old nerd could do it with minimal infrastructure costs. If the bootloader were unlocked, this would be a practical way of doing things.

Lastly, why not provide an unlock method that would caution the user that unlocking the phone would void the warranty and if they proceeded the IMEI of the phone would be logged and no warranty repairs would be allowed. Oh wait, I think someone already did that.

I know this has been beaten to death in thread after thread, but I just had to vent a little. Sorry.

I'm with you on this one. Locked bootloader has nothing to do with warranty claims. Verizon has stated their reasoning publicly.

[cardidark09]

Unlocked bootloaders mean fully functional jelly bean cause u can flash the jb kernels and radio

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[BytecodeMe]

Unlocked bootloaders mean fully functional jelly bean cause u can flash the jb kernels and radio

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

The kernel for JB and ICS are almost exactly the same, and it doesn't matter what radios you have for a build. .181 radios will work on ICS. So we can have an almost fully functioning JB build already.

[Memnoch73]

The kernel for JB and ICS are almost exactly the same, and it doesn't matter what radios you have for a build. .181 radios will work on ICS. So we can have an almost fully functioning JB build already.

Well this is true an unlocked BL means CUSTOM kernels. This is huge. It was a night and day difference on the ThunderBolt with custom kernels over stock.

[FutureBear]

I agree to a certain extent, because replacing those devices does have an administrative cost associated with it. But unless you physically damage the phone it isn't "dead." Manufacturers have toolsets that we don't have and can restore a device to original state very quickly. Our "Hard Brick" is usually just a "Reimage" to them.

Still have to hire people to do that which they don't have to have as many if there weren't crooked people.

[got556]

The JB kernel is pretty good. At least for the Gnex. With that said, it'll be a cold day in hell when VZW allows unlocked BL's again. Just look at the recent issue with the S3 being locked on VZW.....

Damn near impossible to brick a phone w/ an unlocked everything. VZW can choke themselves. They keep adding their bull$!#7 fees and the other companies start catching up to the 4G speeds and coverage and it will only be a matter of time before VZW will be having to take a hard look in the mirror. Granted that will probably be a long long time from now, but I hope it's coming.

From here on out I don't care who makes the phone I will only buy Nexus devices. Secondly I am most likely done with VZW when my contract is up. Even the two unlimited lines just isn't worth the price they command w/ all their other crap fees.

[droid4life]

The JB kernel is pretty good. At least for the Gnex. With that said, it'll be a cold day in hell when VZW allows unlocked BL's again. Just look at the recent issue with the S3 being locked on VZW.....

Damn near impossible to brick a phone w/ an unlocked everything. VZW can choke themselves. They keep adding their bull$!#7 fees and the other companies start catching up to the 4G speeds and coverage and it will only be a matter of time before VZW will be having to take a hard look in the mirror. Granted that will probably be a long long time from now, but I hope it's coming.

From here on out I don't care who makes the phone I will only buy Nexus devices. Secondly I am most likely done with VZW when my contract is up. Even the two unlimited lines just isn't worth the price they command w/ all their other crap fees.

I agree with you I been with VZW for a good while, when my contract ends if things are not any better I will go with someone else as long as my next phone is a Nexus phone I just hope they dont lock all the phones bootloaders by then cause I might just go with the worst phone, the i..... I can't even say the name its so ugly haha. No but on a serious note VZW needs to stop with their $!#7 cause it will catch up to them.

[tucstwo]

I agree with you I been with VZW for a good while, when my contract ends if things are not any better I will go with someone else as long as my next phone is a Nexus phone I just hope they dont lock all the phones bootloaders by then cause I might just go with the worst phone, the i..... I can't even say the name its so ugly haha. No but on a serious note VZW needs to stop with their $!#7 cause it will catch up to them.

You do realize there are 0 custom ROMs AND kernels for the iPhone because they're entire source is closed? If they locked every bootloader in sight we'd still be miles in front of any iOS device.

[tucstwo]

The JB kernel is pretty good. At least for the Gnex. With that said, it'll be a cold day in hell when VZW allows unlocked BL's again. Just look at the recent issue with the S3 being locked on VZW.....

Damn near impossible to brick a phone w/ an unlocked everything. VZW can choke themselves. They keep adding their bull$!#7 fees and the other companies start catching up to the 4G speeds and coverage and it will only be a matter of time before VZW will be having to take a hard look in the mirror. Granted that will probably be a long long time from now, but I hope it's coming.

From here on out I don't care who makes the phone I will only buy Nexus devices. Secondly I am most likely done with VZW when my contract is up. Even the two unlimited lines just isn't worth the price they command w/ all their other crap fees.

The only issue I can see with this theory is this: because VZW is such an 800lb elephant in the room, even as the other providers catch up with them, VZW is such a monster that by then, they will be on 5G and we will all still be suckling on their corporate teats. Even four years from now. This is all wishful thinking, but trust me, you can't stop the big red machine. It's big, powerful and it's self aware. Apocalypse now!

[got556]

tucstwo...you know...I almost typed the "too big to fail" rant. But I believe in corporations and am not a 99% per se and didn't want to come off that way. But I agree with you.

[GoBears]

Verizon does NOT care about the <1% of consumers that actually want to unlock the bootloader. It's a dead issue. As long as the phone is selling well, which it is, they have absolutely no reason to unlock it. People just don't realize how small a percentage of their customers want to hack and mod their phones. Besides, I actually believe they want the soft bricks to refurb for warranty claims. Helluva lot cheaper than replacing phones with new ones.

[larrygeary]

"Well this is true an unlocked BL means CUSTOM kernels. This is huge. It was a night and day difference on the ThunderBolt with custom kernels over stock."

What exactly was different? And what exactly can you do with a custom kernel that can't be done now with kernel modules and boot scripts and the other capabilities devs have now? I'm asking because I don't know.

I would say, though, that by installing a custom kernel you risk breaking existing apps. A dev can test his app on several versions of Android and several standard kernels, but with a proliferation of custom kernels it would not be cost effective to test every one. That's a tradeoff that must be considered.

[Memnoch73]

"Well this is true an unlocked BL means CUSTOM kernels. This is huge. It was a night and day difference on the ThunderBolt with custom kernels over stock."

What exactly was different? And what exactly can you do with a custom kernel that can't be done now with kernel modules and boot scripts and the other capabilities devs have now? I'm asking because I don't know.

I would say, though, that by installing a custom kernel you risk breaking existing apps. A dev can test his app on several versions of Android and several standard kernels, but with a proliferation of custom kernels it would not be cost effective to test every one. That's a tradeoff that must be considered.

Battery Life and Performance!! Both incredibly improved with a custom Kernel. The Kernel Devs out there are highly skilled. Take your favorite Rom and compare it to stock. Now imagine that much change and improvement just focused on the Kernel.

I never saw any broken apps with custom kernels

[arcanexvi]

"Well this is true an unlocked BL means CUSTOM kernels. This is huge. It was a night and day difference on the ThunderBolt with custom kernels over stock."

What exactly was different? And what exactly can you do with a custom kernel that can't be done now with kernel modules and boot scripts and the other capabilities devs have now? I'm asking because I don't know.

I would say, though, that by installing a custom kernel you risk breaking existing apps. A dev can test his app on several versions of Android and several standard kernels, but with a proliferation of custom kernels it would not be cost effective to test every one. That's a tradeoff that must be considered.

Custom kernels can also potentially lead to hardware issues due to overclocks etc. I'm not a supporter of locked bootloaders but the primary reason that they're locked is to save themselves money. End of story. I do believe that we should have an unlock solution that forces us to completely void our warranty (or pricey insurance) if necessary to get it done. That's a sacrifice that many of us would happily take because we know the risks and are willing to fix our own devices (software problems). The assistance community here is strong but not all phones have the luxury we do here.

[Memnoch73]

Custom kernels can also potentially lead to hardware issues due to overclocks etc. I'm not a supporter of locked bootloaders but the primary reason that they're locked is to save themselves money.

Yes this can happen BUT I had the ThunderBolt and also the OG Droid before that and there were a ton of custom kernels floating around for each device. I followed all the forums I could find for both phones. I would say the number of people that post about returning their Razr for insurance or warranty due to likely their own doing is easily 100 times what I saw over the years on other phones. In fact I am hard pressed to remember even one ThunderBolt user returning their bricked phone. If Moto is doing this to save money then I gotta say they are doing it wrong.